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	<title>Comments on: Pain made useful: a story</title>
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	<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story</link>
	<description>Jan Krüger&#039;s blog thingy</description>
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		<title>By: TigerTom</title>
		<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story/comment-page-1#comment-4245</link>
		<dc:creator>TigerTom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 20:57:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jan-krueger.net/?p=102#comment-4245</guid>
		<description>Sounds like basic hypnotism to me. It&#039;s very important to get enough rest and not be &#039;on the go&#039; all the time. We live in the 21st Century but we have the bodies of cavemen. Living in a constant state of anxiety and alertness tells the body you&#039;re at war, it&#039;s not safe, you&#039;re a loser and you&#039;re letting poisons build up in your body.

Notice how if you&#039;re doing something noble or that&#039;s successful, that makes you _truly_ happy, you can keep going for a long time and not feel tired.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sounds like basic hypnotism to me. It&#8217;s very important to get enough rest and not be &#8216;on the go&#8217; all the time. We live in the 21st Century but we have the bodies of cavemen. Living in a constant state of anxiety and alertness tells the body you&#8217;re at war, it&#8217;s not safe, you&#8217;re a loser and you&#8217;re letting poisons build up in your body.</p>
<p>Notice how if you&#8217;re doing something noble or that&#8217;s successful, that makes you _truly_ happy, you can keep going for a long time and not feel tired.</p>
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		<title>By: akpolarmom</title>
		<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story/comment-page-1#comment-3964</link>
		<dc:creator>akpolarmom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 02:12:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jan-krueger.net/?p=102#comment-3964</guid>
		<description>Jan, this seemed to be a nice piece of parts therapy you did. I am sorry you didn&#039;t have a chance to sort it all out. You are on the right track. Now go help the rest of the hurting souls out there!


Your mind is incredibly powerful, put it to work! Remember, it can work both for you or against you, so chose wisely....! 

Always Looking for More Tools,
Akpolarmom

A Trance is a Terrible Thing to Waste, I&#039;ll be Back to put YOURS to Use Soon!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jan, this seemed to be a nice piece of parts therapy you did. I am sorry you didn&#8217;t have a chance to sort it all out. You are on the right track. Now go help the rest of the hurting souls out there!</p>
<p>Your mind is incredibly powerful, put it to work! Remember, it can work both for you or against you, so chose wisely&#8230;.! </p>
<p>Always Looking for More Tools,<br />
Akpolarmom</p>
<p>A Trance is a Terrible Thing to Waste, I&#8217;ll be Back to put YOURS to Use Soon!</p>
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		<title>By: Dennis</title>
		<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story/comment-page-1#comment-3904</link>
		<dc:creator>Dennis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 15:25:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jan-krueger.net/?p=102#comment-3904</guid>
		<description>I think we pretty much agree. &quot;Split&quot; indeed sounds too sharp, but the point is that there are distinguishable parts. Learning that my computer is not just one piece of metal, but has a CPU and a chipset (among other components, this is not meant to be an analogy) let&#039;s me understand its behavior better, but of course those things still form one computer because they are interconnected.

My rider labeled my elephant stubborn because the elephant refused to listen. Just like you said, the rider knows these concepts. Really the elephant was just continually ignorant of the rider, doing it&#039;s own thing, for it&#039;s own reasons. Knowing these reasons is indeed necessary to change that pattern, and like you said, just calling it stubborn did not bring me any further. Yet that&#039;s how I perceived it at the time. If anything, my rider was stubborn in not acknowledging the elephants need.

I do not agree with the following statement: &quot;Without looking at what the rider is doing, you can’t possibly have the slightest idea about what made the elephant go this or that way&quot;

In a healthy human being, that is usually true, concerning the bigger picture. Still, in the moment an elephant does lots of things on its own, like keeping the car on the road. You don&#039;t have to think about that and explicitly command your elephant to do so. Suppose your rider gets distracted by the radio for half an hour, you would probably not have crashed, but gotten off course, without any idea of where you are (at least on something as straightforward as a motorway).

I agree with your last statement. The irony is that when people talk or think about other people, mostly their rider is considered, especially if you do not personally know this person, like celebrities, etc. This is why I (my reasoning, thinking rider) did not really notice me (the quite lovely elephant) for quite some time. It seems to me that regardless of how ugly the rider can get (because of being very malleable), the elephants in most, maybe all people are really beautiful. That&#039;s my source of self-love, perhaps it helps others, too.

Thank you for the book tip, I put it on my wishlist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we pretty much agree. &#8220;Split&#8221; indeed sounds too sharp, but the point is that there are distinguishable parts. Learning that my computer is not just one piece of metal, but has a CPU and a chipset (among other components, this is not meant to be an analogy) let&#8217;s me understand its behavior better, but of course those things still form one computer because they are interconnected.</p>
<p>My rider labeled my elephant stubborn because the elephant refused to listen. Just like you said, the rider knows these concepts. Really the elephant was just continually ignorant of the rider, doing it&#8217;s own thing, for it&#8217;s own reasons. Knowing these reasons is indeed necessary to change that pattern, and like you said, just calling it stubborn did not bring me any further. Yet that&#8217;s how I perceived it at the time. If anything, my rider was stubborn in not acknowledging the elephants need.</p>
<p>I do not agree with the following statement: &#8220;Without looking at what the rider is doing, you can’t possibly have the slightest idea about what made the elephant go this or that way&#8221;</p>
<p>In a healthy human being, that is usually true, concerning the bigger picture. Still, in the moment an elephant does lots of things on its own, like keeping the car on the road. You don&#8217;t have to think about that and explicitly command your elephant to do so. Suppose your rider gets distracted by the radio for half an hour, you would probably not have crashed, but gotten off course, without any idea of where you are (at least on something as straightforward as a motorway).</p>
<p>I agree with your last statement. The irony is that when people talk or think about other people, mostly their rider is considered, especially if you do not personally know this person, like celebrities, etc. This is why I (my reasoning, thinking rider) did not really notice me (the quite lovely elephant) for quite some time. It seems to me that regardless of how ugly the rider can get (because of being very malleable), the elephants in most, maybe all people are really beautiful. That&#8217;s my source of self-love, perhaps it helps others, too.</p>
<p>Thank you for the book tip, I put it on my wishlist.</p>
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		<title>By: Jan</title>
		<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story/comment-page-1#comment-3903</link>
		<dc:creator>Jan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 12:15:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jan-krueger.net/?p=102#comment-3903</guid>
		<description>There are approximately equal parts wisdom and confusion in that metaphor.

The confusion comes from the fact that there isn&#039;t actually any split in the mind. All functions of the mind are separated and connected at the same time. The wisdom is in recognizing that thoughts and feelings are tightly connected (which the metaphor actually acknowledge) and interact very strongly with each other. Thoughts influence feelings, feelings influence thoughts.

Keeping with the metaphor, I&#039;d like to point out that elephants can&#039;t be stubborn. Stubbornness is a human concept based in conscious evaluation of actions. If you label what the elephant is doing as &quot;being stubborn&quot;, you have just reduced the information available to you. Stubbornness is a rather abstract notion; what the elephant is doing in any given moment is not.

Curiously, the same is true for the rider. Without looking at what the rider is doing, you can&#039;t possibly have the slightest idea about what made the elephant go this or that way. Of course, the outside world, the environment the elephant and the rider navigate through, needs to be kept in awareness, too, for the same reason. 

I&#039;d like to recommend a very insightful book about this kind of awareness. It&#039;s called, surprisingly enough, &quot;Awareness&quot;, written by Anthony de Mello.

The most important point I&#039;d like to stress in the rider/elephant metaphor is this: you are not the rider, nor are you the elephant.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are approximately equal parts wisdom and confusion in that metaphor.</p>
<p>The confusion comes from the fact that there isn&#8217;t actually any split in the mind. All functions of the mind are separated and connected at the same time. The wisdom is in recognizing that thoughts and feelings are tightly connected (which the metaphor actually acknowledge) and interact very strongly with each other. Thoughts influence feelings, feelings influence thoughts.</p>
<p>Keeping with the metaphor, I&#8217;d like to point out that elephants can&#8217;t be stubborn. Stubbornness is a human concept based in conscious evaluation of actions. If you label what the elephant is doing as &#8220;being stubborn&#8221;, you have just reduced the information available to you. Stubbornness is a rather abstract notion; what the elephant is doing in any given moment is not.</p>
<p>Curiously, the same is true for the rider. Without looking at what the rider is doing, you can&#8217;t possibly have the slightest idea about what made the elephant go this or that way. Of course, the outside world, the environment the elephant and the rider navigate through, needs to be kept in awareness, too, for the same reason. </p>
<p>I&#8217;d like to recommend a very insightful book about this kind of awareness. It&#8217;s called, surprisingly enough, &#8220;Awareness&#8221;, written by Anthony de Mello.</p>
<p>The most important point I&#8217;d like to stress in the rider/elephant metaphor is this: you are not the rider, nor are you the elephant.</p>
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		<title>By: Dennis</title>
		<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story/comment-page-1#comment-3774</link>
		<dc:creator>Dennis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Jun 2009 16:46:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jan-krueger.net/?p=102#comment-3774</guid>
		<description>A few weeks I ago I read a book about happiness and found a great Buddhist metaphor in it. Essentially, our mind is split in multiple ways, one of which is the emotional/rational split. The Buddhist metaphor describes the emotional part as an elephant and the rational part as its rider. Whatever you do, your elephant is with you. Sometimes you can let go and the elephant indulges in whatever it likes, sometimes the rider has to steer the elephant to prevent it from harming itself. Most of the time, you have to steer the elephant to reach long term goals.

There came a time where I noticed that I seemed to follow all these rules and demands and became more and more unhappy. More and more, my elephant distrusted its rider and ignored its commands, rendering me a seemingly dishonest person - someone who promises one thing and does other things. My rider had the best intentions, but my elephant was very stubborn.

Psychologically, my impulse control was severely damaged. But I also read that impulse control is like a muscle. You can train it. It seems to me that I needed some time for the muscle to heal, and now I&#039;m in recovery, training it. Of course you have to do that responsibly. Saying &quot;I will work eight hours every day, starting tomorrow&quot; is like saying &quot;I will lift 100kg weights for four hours in a row every day, starting tomorrow&quot;. It won&#039;t work. You might be able to get there, but not right away.

&lt;em&gt;&quot;The gist of it was that I suggested to his body to stop the pain as long as Chris went easy enough on himself to stay reasonably healthy&quot;&lt;/em&gt;

Getting back to the metaphor, your elephant has to learn to trust its rider again, and for that the rider has to make good choices. And for that it has to listen to the elephant, get to know it really well, otherwise the elephant will ignore him again. So be a smart rider. Think about your long-term goals. Then think about how you&#039;re going to implement these goals. This is called making implementation intentions. But for every intention, ask your elephant kindly, whether he feels up to it. If the elephant gets anxious, you&#039;re asking for too much. What you&#039;re aiming at is a response like &quot;Okay, I think I can do that. It takes some effort, but it&#039;s possible&quot;. Once you got that, thank your elephant for its cooperation. Every person essentially is a team of a rider and an elephant. Whatever you do, you&#039;re both in this together. The elephant needs to trust the rider to make wise choices - but also to let go when it&#039;s alright.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few weeks I ago I read a book about happiness and found a great Buddhist metaphor in it. Essentially, our mind is split in multiple ways, one of which is the emotional/rational split. The Buddhist metaphor describes the emotional part as an elephant and the rational part as its rider. Whatever you do, your elephant is with you. Sometimes you can let go and the elephant indulges in whatever it likes, sometimes the rider has to steer the elephant to prevent it from harming itself. Most of the time, you have to steer the elephant to reach long term goals.</p>
<p>There came a time where I noticed that I seemed to follow all these rules and demands and became more and more unhappy. More and more, my elephant distrusted its rider and ignored its commands, rendering me a seemingly dishonest person &#8211; someone who promises one thing and does other things. My rider had the best intentions, but my elephant was very stubborn.</p>
<p>Psychologically, my impulse control was severely damaged. But I also read that impulse control is like a muscle. You can train it. It seems to me that I needed some time for the muscle to heal, and now I&#8217;m in recovery, training it. Of course you have to do that responsibly. Saying &#8220;I will work eight hours every day, starting tomorrow&#8221; is like saying &#8220;I will lift 100kg weights for four hours in a row every day, starting tomorrow&#8221;. It won&#8217;t work. You might be able to get there, but not right away.</p>
<p><em>&#8220;The gist of it was that I suggested to his body to stop the pain as long as Chris went easy enough on himself to stay reasonably healthy&#8221;</em></p>
<p>Getting back to the metaphor, your elephant has to learn to trust its rider again, and for that the rider has to make good choices. And for that it has to listen to the elephant, get to know it really well, otherwise the elephant will ignore him again. So be a smart rider. Think about your long-term goals. Then think about how you&#8217;re going to implement these goals. This is called making implementation intentions. But for every intention, ask your elephant kindly, whether he feels up to it. If the elephant gets anxious, you&#8217;re asking for too much. What you&#8217;re aiming at is a response like &#8220;Okay, I think I can do that. It takes some effort, but it&#8217;s possible&#8221;. Once you got that, thank your elephant for its cooperation. Every person essentially is a team of a rider and an elephant. Whatever you do, you&#8217;re both in this together. The elephant needs to trust the rider to make wise choices &#8211; but also to let go when it&#8217;s alright.</p>
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		<title>By: Teplin</title>
		<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story/comment-page-1#comment-3724</link>
		<dc:creator>Teplin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 20:42:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jan-krueger.net/?p=102#comment-3724</guid>
		<description>You know this stuff fascinates me.  I&#039;m still interested in being your guinea pig to try it over IRC when you get back.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know this stuff fascinates me.  I&#8217;m still interested in being your guinea pig to try it over <acronym title="Internet Relay Chat">IRC</acronym> when you get back.</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Eric</title>
		<link>http://jan-krueger.net/life/pain-made-useful-a-story/comment-page-1#comment-3723</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 18:04:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jan-krueger.net/?p=102#comment-3723</guid>
		<description>Hey, this was interesting. Definitely post more stuff like this. I&#039;ll keep reading if you do.

-Jon</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, this was interesting. Definitely post more stuff like this. I&#8217;ll keep reading if you do.</p>
<p>-Jon</p>
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